Kansas.com KSN

by joanna

There’s been some discussion on here about who will go D-I, either out of high school or after a couple years at a juco. Sometimes it’s easy to see — I think we all knew the first time we saw Bryce Brown play that he was something special. But other predictions aren’t as easy.

So what makes a Division I athlete? Many times I think collegecoaches are specificially looking at size, height, weight, etc. What else is a factor? What should be a factor? (heart, attitude, etc.)

By the way, this is definitely not just a football or just a basketball discussion. Got an idea of what a D-I volleyball player or swimmer should look like? Let’s hear it.

  • jjflash2b

    A lot of it has to do with the three S’s, size, speed and strength.Then there is the entangable, heart, which can’t be measured, but is just as important or qualifying as the other three.

  • Naive

    I think a Div. 1 prospect should be;
    A athlete that will go to class.
    A female athlete. Title 9 a good thing.
    A athlete with self motivation.
    A athlete that doesn’t always ask what is in it for them.
    A athlete that can make a decision without Mom and Dad or others.
    A athlete that isn’t stuck in High School success.
    A athlete that understands what is best for the team isn’t always what makes them look good.
    A athlete that loves their sport and appreciates their own talent.

  • For Pete’s Sake

    Any player that a division 1 coach deems a division 1 prospect.

  • gingene2

    There is a club volleyball team called the Raiders who are all 8th and 9th graders playing in high school tourneys this winter and more than holding their own. They have some very good players who will be worth watching. They are athletic and seem to really know the game.

  • RikRok

    I’d add a fourth “S”: smarts, another one that is overlooked.

  • Crack

    For Pete’s Sake don’t be Naive.

  • For Pete’s Sake

    You don’t get to be a division 1 player unless a division 1 coach wants you now do you crack addict?

  • Naive

    For Pete’s Sake, Crack is only trying to be funny. Keep trying Crack it might happen sometime :}

  • For Pete’s Sake

    That is why crack is whack as Whitney would say.

  • buff1

    Perry Ellis
    Blake Bell
    Joe Mitchell ?

    Just watch them play the game. It’s men against boys!

  • jjflash2b

    Thats right Rok, something that is definitely looked at, at all levels of college athletic’s. At the NCAA level D1 and D2, academic’s are important on how much scholarship money is availiable to the student athlete. So the fourth “S” as you stated is probably one of the first in the order of a prospect.

  • jjflash2b

    On a continuing note that Fourth “S” should be the first in the order of the group, because after the size, speed and strength are gone, the smarts are whats going to get you further in life after your career in athletic’s is over, unless you develop some form of dementia, in which thats a different subject or topic that Joanna could use or needs to address when she runs out of idea’s for discussions. It would be a good one because there are quite a few individuals on here that are pushing into the realms of that particular status!

  • Joanna

    Great post, jj. Dementia, hmm. We could do a whole series on that using some of you as examples, is that what you’re suggesting?

  • Dreams vs Reality

    There are a lot of kids and parents that get caught up in the D1 status of the sports world. The reality from the Wichita market how many kids have went D1 on the boys side, girls in different sports in the last 5 years.

    How do you market your kid? How much talent does your kid have Dreams vs Reality! The reality is to get a free education for doing something you love to do!

  • For Pete’s Sake

    Its not the free ride they are necessarily after. After all the education part doesn’t bring the fame, notoriety, and money that pro athletics do right? The reality is not many kids get that shot at D-1 athletics and fewer get that opportunity to do it in the professional ranks.

  • Naive

    Joanna, Your topics and ideas are wonderful. I’m a parent of an athlete that is being recruited by D-1 and D-2 schools and find it asset to read your blog. It seems that you do the majority of the work down at the Eagle and you deserve everyone’s appreciation.

  • ProudDad

    What were we talking about again? And where did I leave my glasses?

  • jjflash2b

    There you go Joanna, your first subject matter!

  • jjflash2b

    Hey Naive, don’t be too naive! Joanna is good at what she does, but don’t give her too many prop’s. It might go to her head and she’ll become the next Brian Butler. If that happens then she might be able to help you out with that D1/D2 scholarship!

  • Coach EM

    As far as football goes, a kid has to pass the eyeball test, any D1 coach will tell you that. If they dont pass that, then it really doesnt matter about any of the other stuff weve passed along.

  • Naive

    Hey jj, It’s not just about scholarships. It can also be about the best coaches, schools and competition out there. I hope it does go to her head or she might get discouraged by bad sarcasm.

  • jjflash2b

    You know, I hate to be the first to ask this Coach, but what in the heck is the eyeball test? Please be gentle! I know this could get ugly!!

  • Joanna

    This is my favorite topic in a long time. Most of the posts are making me chuckle. Then again, maybe this is the first sign of dementia setting in here.
    But hey, I appreciate the nice comment here and there. Helps balancing out those ones who hate on me or on others.

  • jjflash2b

    This subject started out good and all, but now look where you’ve led us Joanna….off on another tangent! A true sign of dementia!!

  • Naive

    jj, you seem kind of knowledgeable about dementia. Or did cocktail hour start early.

  • jjflash2b

    This is getting out of hand! Why would you even start a discussion about cocktail’s and drinking? Before you know it RikRok and his buddies will be on here discussing the ability of alcohol and the affects it has on people watching sports! No telling where this one is gonna go….oh yeah, I did work in the health care field for a number of years and saw quite a few patients with varying levels of dementia.

  • Jamie O’hara

    I think that Kansas athletes are too obsessed with going D-1. In reality, there are very few prospects that actually make it D-1. The amount of colleges in the state of Kansas makes kids here think that every kid deserves a D-1 scholarship. Kansas has around 20 junior colleges that HAVE to have kansas kids and they get the best because they can promise, while its legitimate or not is another topic, a D-1 scholarship after two years of playing for them. Plus they can offer the best scholarship packages besides the D-1 and D-2 school full rides. Kansas has around 20 or more private schools that offer scholarships but can’t compete with the money the jucos pay. More and more of the private schools are looking to places out of state, example Texas, because the kids down there do not have the opportunity and the amount of colleges Kansas has per student. Kids here think that they are good and going D-1 if they receive a letter from a D-1 school. They send out thousands of those to anyone that has any kind of all-state honors. It would be interesting to see how many in state kids have actually made it D-1 out of juco. Just my observations. Sorry for rambling.

  • Trak Parent

    Andrew Etheridge- outstanding hurdler should go d1
    Robby Garcia- d1 athlete
    Mike Flores-d1 athlete
    Demarcus Robbinson- Outstanding track athlete and fball player

  • Swim Mom

    My memory’s not as sharp as it used to be.
    Also, my memory’s not as sharp as it used to be.

  • balla

    Alex Schooler. period

  • Coach EM

    JJ

    The eyeball test is generally how physically well put together a kid is. If your an OL, how tall and how wide your frame is. Height and weight, percentage of body fat, and how much quality weight they think they can put on you is definitely taken into account.

    I remember when I was working KSU camp under RP, and the OL coach asked me about a skinny 6’7 kid that was there, and I commented that I would rather have the other 6’3 kid. His comment was that he could not even talk to him, because there was an unwritten rule in the program that the kid had to be at least 6’4…called it the NFL frame. As you can see, it got him really far.

  • Swim Mom

    I like how Dreams stated it “The reality is to get a free education for doing something you love to do!”

    I don’t think D-1, D-2, etc. will matter to my kid as long as he gets to swim, and he gets the education he desires.

    I also like the 4 S items mentioned above. I sure hope that Smarts counts for something.

    Alas, my memory’s not as sharp as it used to be.

    Coach EM I’m curious about the eyeball thing, too.

  • Coach EM

    If a school says that they dont care how big you are, they are lying, or how fast you are. Those are the two things they can not make you. Unfortuanately I have seen and coached fantastic players that do not fit their charts and played at differing levels.

    There are exceptions. Darren Sproles is definitely one, and I believe without a doubt that DeMarcus Robinson will be an exception.

  • jjflash2b

    Thanks EM Coach for your reply and not slamming me for not knowing! I wasn’t quite sure where that eyeball test thing was going!
    Now I know! There might be something to that eyeball test, especially at certain positions, but you can’t always size a kid up by his physical stature. As the saying goes, “you can’t judge a book by it’s cover”, just like you can’t measure the heart of an athlete. Darren Sproles may have never gotten a chance if that were the case.

  • Sports Gal

    Coach EM: Why would DeMarcus Robinson be an exception? Would it be his height? He is a pretty big kid and very fast. Just curious!

  • Koog

    There were some mentions on here about D1 and D2 full ride scholarships. D1 there are full ride scholarships. D2 there are very few, if any, full ride scholarships.

    D2 football is limited to 36 full tuition, books, room, board, and incidentals scholarships. In KS that is somewhere around $20,000 per year or in the neighborhood of $720,000 total. For a D2, to have 100 football team members that is an average of $7,200 per team member. I believe D1 is allowed 85 full ride only, you are either on a full ride or you are a walk on (you can have academic scholarships).

    D1 basketball is 13 full ride, not sure about D2 but it is probably 6 or 7. I know D1 cross country, track, baseball, softball are split scholarships as are D2.

  • 13_Lucky

    Jamie,

    The jucos can only offer books and tuition… no full rides. However, they are a very affordable option for the 1st 2 years of school. Each juco is required to have a specific number of in state kids on the roster and is limited on the number of out of state/international athletes. The numbers are dependent on the sport. Further, Kansas kids are typically at a disadvantage when competing for D-1 scholarships (even in state) due to KSHSAA restrictions and overall perceptions.

  • Spartan fan

    It is kind of like Justice Potter Stewart of the United States Supreme Court said when the court was trying to define pornography: “I know it when I see it”

  • goosej

    D1 FBS can have up to 85 scholarship players (all must be full scholarships)

    D1 FCS can offer up to a total of 63 scholarships (may be full or partial but total can not exceed the 63)

  • Jim Cross

    D1 Track allows 13 so called full rides. When my son was a Arkansas from 95-00 there were only 4 full rides given. The other 9 scholarships were divided among the rest of the track team. Some of the other bloggers mentioned “smarts”. At Arkansas if your smarts started slipping a little, you were in study hall, no exception!

  • RikRok

    Alcohol? Did JJ mention alcohol?

  • goosej

    Forgot to mention I was referring to football. Most programs have manadatory study hall for all freshmen.

  • Mess My Drawers

    Well I can tell you one thing for sure…as a coach I would never sacrifice my team just to give one or two guys a shot at a D1 scholarship nor would I ask my players parents to tell me who to play.

  • Dreams vs Reality

    What is a High School coach’s job to do? Is it to build their team and individuals to gain Scholaships? Is it to only build a good record for the school? Is it to call schools for kids to live their Dreams to go to colloge? If you are an A student do you have an opportunity to take special classes, better than the average student? If you are the best athlete at your school should you be rewarded with better opportunities to go to college for sports?

  • ks07

    A division one kid is an athlete who is recruited by division one schools.

  • Coach EM

    Sports Gal,

    Mac is a great running back, one of the finest I have had to watch in the City League since moving here in the 90′s. He has incredible quickness, and is well put together.

    When a D1 coach looks at roster, his size–roughly 5’9 and 180 pounds, just doesnt jump out at you like some others might (Joeseph Randle 6′ 200, Bryce Brown 6′ 210??). People worry about the wear and tear. Sproles has brokes the mold somewhat for smaller backs, as well as the great Barry Sanders. But that “eyeball test” is still there.

    I would take DeMarcus on my team anyday, anytime, and go play anyone. He more heart than can be measured that is certain.

  • Sports Gal

    Thanks Coach!

  • Coach EM

    Your welcome sports gal,

    And just in case anyone was wondering, Demarcus has about 4 D1 offers at the moment.

  • justanotherfan

    For boys, almost every D-1 athlete I have ever seen has been a freak of nature athletically. D-1 athletes stick out in high school games. They just do. If I told you before you walked into the gym that a D-1 caliber player would be on the floor that night, you should be able to walk in and within 5 minutes spot the D-1 prospect without question.

    In football, sheer size doesn’t cut it. You have to have speed and quickness, agility. Even bigger guys that go D-1 now are agile, if not speedsters.

    The smarts part is also true. Bad grades or test scores will knock a marginal prospect off the board for a lot of programs.

    The last element is exposure. Part of going D-1, as Pete said, is being tabbed a D-1 player. If D-1 coaches never see you, you will not go D-1, period. Doesn’t matter how fast or strong or quick or athletic you are. If the scouts and coaches don’t see you, you are not going D-1.

  • RikRok

    And just because a DI school or two sends you a letter, do yourself a favor and not label yourself a “DI recruit” because you most likely will end up disappointed.

  • Coach EM

    Thank goodness for Potential Players to remedy that problem!

  • spartan for life

    I wonder if Bryce wishes he would have signed on signing day with the NCAA investigating Butler and other players he worked with. I hope if he is doing something shady it does not affect the kids that would really be sad.

  • Toothless Hillbilly

    I’m glad Collegiate marketed Schooler otherwise i’d still be lookin at a picture of Ned Beatty on the wall of my outhouse!

  • For Pete’s Sake

    I would say I told you so about Butler, but I told you so. Of course, this is the organization still investigating Reggie Bush so Bryce could be going into the Pro Football Hall of Fame before they find anything.

  • http://floorsander.co.cc Floor Sanders

    “Define a Division I prospect, Sorry I’m late adding this comment. Added you to my RSS feed.